Episode Summary

Today we dive into the nuances of personal finance, challenge financial stereotypes, and explore how they might be influencing your relationship. In this episode, Mary Beth Storjohann and Neela Hummel discuss the common stereotypes around money management within relationships and share their personal experiences about how these assumptions have played out in their lives. They tackle a variety of themes from the ingrained idea that ‘money is a man’s work,’ to who should handle the investing, to the societal pressures and expectations when women are the breadwinners. Tune in for this candid, sometimes humorous, but insightful conversation and let’s reflect on the financial dynamics that can play out in relationships.

What You’ll Learn in this Episode:

• Some of the financial stereotypes that exist as cultural norms or practices
• How some of these stereotypes show up in heterosexual relationships
• The challenges with one partner handling all of the finances
• Societal expectations for men and women when it comes to paying the bill 
• How better financial outcomes can come when both partners are engaged financially
• The stereotype behind who handles investments and how studies have countered the societal expectation
• The struggle women face, especially as breadwinners in heterosexual relationships and the additional pressure society puts on them
• The importance of good communication and an equitable division of financial roles within a household
• Why many stereotypes around money should be challenged

Resources Mentioned on the Show:

• The Gender Wage Gap and What to Do About It
• The Gender Wealth Gap and What to Do About It
• Fair Play by Eve Rodsky
• Financial Planning for Women
• Abacus Academy

Stay Connected:

• Connect with Mary Beth on Twitter, Instagram, and on LinkedIn
• Connect with Neela on Twitter, Instagram, and on LinkedIn
• Join the Abacus community by connecting with us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and on LinkedIn

Transcript of the Episode

Neela [00:00:14]:

Hey there. Welcome to the If Money Were Easy podcast, the show where we teach you how to expand what’s possible with your money. We’re your hosts, Neela Hummel 

Mary Beth [00:00:23]:

and Mary Beth Storjohann,

Neela [00:00:25]:

certified financial planners and co CEO’s of Abacus Wealth Partners. Today on the show, we’re going to talk about, are financial stereotypes playing out in your relationship? 

Mary Beth [00:00:37]:

I don’t know. Are they? 

Neela [00:00:38]:

Oh, gosh, is this our relationship or is this, oh, is it our couple relationship? Maybe, maybe no, we’re breaking all of them between the two of us. I mean, perhaps where we start here. So you think about financial stereotypes, and you almost don’t have to look any further than the financial media to find some of these. And a lot of the messaging that you get growing up or working with clients of all different ages. What are some of those stereotypes that you’ve encountered? 

Mary Beth [00:01:09]:

The men handle the money.

Neela [00:01:10]:

Money’s man’s work. 

Mary Beth [00:01:12]:

Only talk to the men about the money. We always put the man’s name first on the reports or the documents. We greet the man first. We’re lucky you bring the wives sometimes, right? Yeah, I’d say that’s probably the main one. Yeah is that money, money is man’s work. 

Neela [00:01:29]:

It follows the line. Have you ever gotten that actual physical mail where it says, like, mister and misses Brian Storjohann? 

Mary Beth [00:01:37]:

Yes, yes, yes. I had to think for taking his last name wasn’t like an immediate decision. 

Neela [00:01:44]:

Yeah. 

Mary Beth [00:01:46]:

But, yeah, the man handling the money. It’s funny because we’ve made so much progress in many ways. We can throw all the statistics at you that I know we’ve talked about in other podcasts, and despite the progress that we have made, it’s still such a popular stereotype. 

Neela [00:02:01]:

Why is that? 

Mary Beth [00:02:01]:

It just exists. It just exists. Like, it’s just there in so many ways in our lives. And it’s interesting. 

Neela [00:02:09]:

Yeah, I think we can pull back the layers on that, too, as we think about how much shame can come with money. This, like, I should know this and I don’t. And that this narrative can perpetuate that, because if nobody really knows about money, you’re quick to off ramp yourself and be like, well, who am I to opine on this? Because I don’t even understand this complicated stuff.

Mary Beth [00:02:31]:

Right. Tell me, how has the stereotype shown up in your life? 

Neela [00:02:35]:

It’s really interesting in that it hasn’t so much in terms of, like, our day to day finances, because, shocker, I handle the bulk of the money and the movements and the planning and all of that. And so it’s almost in my life, it’s shown up in the reverse, where I find myself having the conversations that I’ll have with clients, where you have one spouse who’s maybe not aware of what’s happening. I feel like I do that with my husband, where I’m like, ooh, I want to make sure he knows what’s happening. And so I really try and, like, bring him in and make sure that I’m not operating in a vacuum, because I’ve seen how that can play out with clients where only one person has all the information or is making the calls. 

Mary Beth [00:03:19]:

Absolutely. Yes.

Neela [00:03:20]:

I think the other place where it shows up in how society reacts to that. So if I call, I think we’ve talked about this. You know, you call a repair person or somebody to come in, you’ve never met them before, and they come in, and you’re standing there with your spouse, and they’re only talking to your spouse, and then you’re like, sir, I called you. 

Mary Beth [00:03:40]:

Yes, yes. 

Neela [00:03:42]:

Who do you think is making this decision, because that’s like the default.

Mary Beth [00:03:44]:

Exactly. I love our contractor, for that reason. Contractor was like, I know you make the decision. So he didn’t disregard Brian, but he called me all the time. He’s like, thank you. Thank you. 

Neela [00:03:54]:

When you’re put in the to, and. And then your partner is put in the cc position it’s kind of… 

Mary Beth [00:03:58]:

Yes. Yeah, exactly. 

Neela [00:04:00]:

So I think that’s where it’s shown up the most. What about for you and Brian? 

Mary Beth [00:04:03]:

You know, same in terms of the big ones. In terms of bringing him in, I am guilty of doing my magic and moving all the money to different accounts. And then he’s like, what happened? 

Neela [00:04:15]:

I walk away for five minutes. What have you done? 

Mary Beth [00:04:17]:

Even today. It was actually very funny. Today, he’s like, an aside, but probably classic. I ordered some things on Target, and so he went and picked them up. And then one of the things that worked out, he went to return it, and he came back. He said, I didn’t realize that wreath was dollar 40. I was like, yeah. He’s like, oh, yeah. The woman was surprised, too, when she put the money back on her credit card. 

Neela [00:04:37]:

Don’t worry about it. Don’t worry about it. 

Mary Beth [00:04:39]:

Just trying some new things. We returned it. I would say an interesting thing that shows up. So I have two experiences that stand out my mind in terms of stereotypes, and this one happened not with Brian, but with somebody else I was dating. We went to Paris, and I was breadwinner in that relationship as well. And we were sitting at a cafe outside, I pulled out my credit card and paid for whatever we’re having. And the waiter laughed at…at my partner. Yeah the guy that I was with, basically was like, you’re going to let her pay? Like, he called him out. 

Neela [00:05:16]:

Wow.

Mary Beth [00:05:17]:

He called him out. I mean, he was embarrassed. I was embarrassed. I remember it vividly. So it was very much like, you know, maybe it was, like, cultural as well, but it was very interesting of, like, how could you let her pay? And so I think of that, and it was the thing that just popped into my mind. I’ve not really reflected and dug into. But when we go out, when Brian and I go out, I let him take out his credit card to pay. And so that is interesting thing where I. I do, too, sometimes, like, with different things, but when we’re out with couples or, like, group dates, I usually just let him handle the bill. Maybe. I don’t know if it’s maybe because I always handled the bill with all of my friends, but when I think about it now, I’m like, oh, like, I let him take out his credit card to pay. I don’t know what that is, but that might be a stereotype that plays out. And because we talk about thinking about kids, like, did your dad pay for everything growing up? 

Neela [00:05:58]:

Right. 

Mary Beth [00:05:58]:

I don’t know if that’s. Is this a way that I’m telling myself I’m taking care of? I don’t know. So we won’t psychoanalyze me now, but that’s an interesting thing that just popped into my mind. 

Neela [00:06:07]:

That is super interesting. And, you know, the breadwinner component, the family exposure component, what are the influences in your life that might lead to that? I think that’s a really interesting point. 

Mary Beth [00:06:17]:

Yeah. And so I don’t know if it’s me trying to. I’m the breadwinner, but do I need to, like, show that by pulling out my credit card and being the one who paid? Because I very vividly remember that thing that happened in Paris. Anyways, interesting, though. 

Neela [00:06:29]:

Very interesting. Yeah. You know, it’s funny that you say that, because if you do pay attention when you go out to dinner, how often is the bill put in front of you? Oh, versus Brian. 

Mary Beth [00:06:39]:

Exactly. There was one time we went out to dinner, I posted on social media about this, where the server took the credit card. He did come back, and without looking at it, he’s like, whose card is this? He asked us which one, and so I took it. It was mine. And he’s like, you never know. And so I was like, thank you for asking. And he’s like, you never know who brings in the money. And I was like, thanks. So…

Neela [00:06:57]:

Yeah, I think that’s an interesting one. 

Mary Beth [00:06:59]:

Yeah. So now you’re going to think about it in your life. 

Neela [00:07:01]:

Now I’m going to psychoanalyze it. Now I’m like, I need to go out to some really fun restaurants to really test the theme. 

Mary Beth [00:07:07]:

You really understand exactly what I got to do. That’s what we should do. We’ll come back and report to you all. 

Neela [00:07:12]:

Right. So one of the ones that I think comes up, I feel like I noticed this in friend groups. I noticed this with prospective clients, is that men in particular are the ones that handle the investing. I don’t know if you see that, too. You know, and again, we’re talking about a heterosexual couple here, is that I’m handling the budgets and my husband handles the investing. Do you see that? 

Mary Beth [00:07:33]:

Oh, yes. I mean, in our peer groups, our friend groups, and with clients as well. Yes. 

Neela [00:07:38]:

Right. I think this is super interesting. Cause, you know, we did our episode on the gender wealth gap, which is worse than the gender pay gap. And one of the reasons for that is from investing that we’re big proponents that women need to invest and women need to invest aggressively because we’re living longer, we’re spending more time out of the workforce, caring for family, and then the gender pay gap, which exacerbates all of those pieces. And so I find it super interesting that there is this division of labor, that the investing, this big, scary world of investing is given to men, when we also see that the data shows that

Mary Beth [00:08:16]:

Women are better. 

Neela [00:08:17]:

Women are better investors.

Mary Beth [00:08:18]:

Women are better. So it’s funny seeing it with clients. I mean, it’s not funny. We’re used to it in the client world. I think I am more infuriated by it in my friend group when I see the dynamic with couples, when you hear it playing out, because with clients, we advise them. And so we can still see it and we can advise if we’re involved in there. But it’s always very interesting to me, and I don’t know if you have this as well, but we got, with couples, the men talk to me about finances. They’re talking about investing or their guy or their products that they’re investing in. And sometimes my head wants to explode, but also not my clients, and typically closer with the wives. 

Neela [00:08:55]:

Right.

Mary Beth [00:08:55]:

So trying to figure out how to navigate that slope. 

Neela [00:08:58]:

So how do you respond to those? Because I get those too. You often get this looking for validation of, like, a stock pick or a company earning report or something. 

Mary Beth [00:09:10]:

Or a whole life insurance product that’s been sold to them. 

Neela [00:09:12]:

Right. 

Mary Beth [00:09:13]:

Or tax shelters. I take some deep breaths, and I typically am pretty direct. That’s a ridiculous idea. And feel free to call me if you want to know more. Right. I’m kind of direct in that sense of, like, commissions. And I give a couple nuggets of why these things don’t make sense or why it’s risky in terms of some of these things, and then I leave it. But I do tend to speak candidly in front of my female friends about the importance of female financial power and independence and investing in retirement accounts. So I don’t advise, but I speak about women in general doing these things. And so I try to not tell them what to do. Right. But I’m not as direct as I want to be. I am to Brian. I am to Brian afterwards. How about you? 

Neela [00:10:03]:

Yeah, I think it’s very similar. I think one of the things I’ve tried to do is if people aren’t feeling confident about making the investing decisions in their houses, then you at least need to be a part of the decision making process. Like, at least know what is there and know what the plan is. And if you have questions, then it’s time to bring in a third party. If you don’t have that third party, if I talk to a friend who says that their spouse does the investing of either gender and that they have a guy, then you better make sure you know that guy, too. 

Mary Beth [00:10:34]:

The guy. 

Neela [00:10:35]:

Right. 

Mary Beth [00:10:35]:

Always a guy. 

Neela [00:10:36]:

It’s always a guy. 

Mary Beth [00:10:37]:

It’s never a woman. 

Neela [00:10:38]:

I gotta guy.

Mary Beth [00:10:39]:

Yeah, I up for a gal. I always hear I’ve got a guy. 

Neela [00:10:42]:

But I think it’s really important, too, because we talk about the impact of things like the gender wealth gap and the fact that when there are ways that people can be financially taken advantage of and that the not knowing is one of the worst parts. 

Mary Beth [00:10:56]:

Yep. 

Neela [00:10:56]:

And so you don’t have to put somebody on blast to be like, hey, where is our money? I want to see it. I’d love to know your strategy. You don’t have to know anything to invite those conversations.

Mary Beth [00:11:06]:

Exactly. Yep. Yeah. And I’d say the other thing, when it does come up, I will ask more thoughtful questions as well, like, what are you trying to accomplish? What are you trying to achieve? What’s your goal behind this? And I always say I get frustrated because it’s usually about a quick buck return. Right. That’s usually what’s driving the… 

Neela [00:11:24]:

Sexy stock, sexy story. 

Mary Beth [00:11:28]:

It’s not sexy. Sorry. But, you know, that’s just not necessarily the target client. But I agree. Encouraging my female friends to ask questions, and I do ask what their thoughts are around money. And it’s very interesting, too, like, to hear what their perspectives are, whether it’s cultural, whether it’s independence for themselves. And so hearing their approaches to that, some of my networks, the independence, making sure they’ll be okay, so they make sure they’ll be okay should anything happen. So having the slush fund and everybody’s been advised by some friends, have been advised by their moms to keep a separate account just in case. So they have that, but they’re still deferring on the investment since they don’t understand I’ll be okay, but they don’t actually know what’s being left on the table, so that’s hard. 

Neela [00:12:10]:

I think that’s another validating idea of if there is a third person in the room, that third person should be serving both spouses. 

Mary Beth [00:12:18]:

Correct.

Neela [00:12:18]:

I was just reading an article today that. That women are leaving their financial advisors at, like, record numbers. And I feel like I’ve been reading that same article for the last 15 years.

Mary Beth [00:12:27]:

Yes.

Neela [00:12:27]:

Right. And yet it seems to be coming more and more of a deluge. And the number one reason is because it’s like they don’t feel like they are part of the relationship. And so if you have somebody in your life who is that third person, that should work for both of you, because your family should have an income plan, your family should have goals, even if you manage things in a separate way, you guys, everybody’s got to be kind of on the same path. And then that person should be helping you get there, because, to your point, not about a quick buck. Right. It’s about what is this money going to do for you? 

Mary Beth [00:12:58]:

Absolutely. Let’s talk about this next one. I think it’s very interesting because it impacts us, but also just society as a whole. Men should be the breadwinners in their families. We obviously break this in our families. And the stereotype just exists, though. Like, society is built around this stereotype. And so even though there’s an increasing number of female breadwinners. 

Neela [00:13:21]:

40%.

Mary Beth [00:13:22]:

Yeah, exactly. 

Neela [00:13:22]:

40%. And growing, I think stat I saw.

Mary Beth [00:13:23]:

40% and growing. And so society has yet to catch up on this, though. And so the expectations that are there, the framework that is there. You got a call from school today, for example. It’s the infrastructure. The systems are not there to support the change. And the men, being the breadwinner, is still the default. 

Neela [00:13:43]:

Yeah. And I think the system is slow to change. And I think the reason so many women are so burnt out is that women are, you’ve heard the quote of, like, women are expected to work as if they don’t have children. Right? Don’t talk about your kids. Cause that’s so unprofessional. But then also raise your kids as if you don’t work. And so then you’re like, but do women also get asleep? Are we allowed to rest? Do we get to do anything for ourselves? And I think it is interesting because, and especially where you live, who your friend groups are, the values that you were brought up within your family. It does seem with the numbers that it’s almost half of women are the breadwinners in their families, that everything hasn’t really caught up to that message.

Mary Beth [00:14:27]:

And I think the important thing about this, though, is, yes, society hasn’t caught up, but are you having the conversations in your household about how society has not caught up? And so what are you doing in your life to get that support? And how can you create that change? Because I think that’s a big one. This is why we’re pushing against the stereotype. An increasing number of women are becoming the breadwinners. Society is not catching up when you are pushing on a brick wall, trying to move society expectation. This is why women fall out of the workforce. This is why men end up becoming the breadwinners again, because of the burnout that’s being placed. And so this number, it is hard to maintain when everything’s working against you in that way.

Neela [00:15:05]:

Yeah, yeah. So I love that question because it’s making sure, knowing that this is happening in so many households, making sure that you are having those conversations and really kind of putting it all on the table.

Mary Beth [00:15:17]:

Yeah. 

Neela [00:15:18]:

Because I wasn’t always the breadwinner, and then I became the breadwinner, and there was, like, a lot of pride there. And then also, then I felt all the pressure, which happens regardless of what gender you are. If you are the breadwinner, you’re feeling it. 

Mary Beth [00:15:31]:

Right, you’re feeling it. 

Neela [00:15:31]:

Because you know that something happens to you or your livelihood and the ramifications are felt across your entire family. 

Mary Beth [00:15:38]:

Yep. You and I have talked about this before, too, you know, and our, our husbands are especially supportive, but not every relationship looks the same. And so when you are the breadwinner and you are trying to have those conversations, and even Brian also, who’s like, absolutely, I’m totally fine with it. You know, his mom was breadwinner growing up as well, so he’s been exposed to it, but society has their expectations of him as well. So, you know, in terms of, like, where he’s showing up and what he needs to be doing. And so, like, how does that impact him in terms of just, like, what he carries or that kind of pressure and mental health load? So there’s that, and then there’s also those, again, who aren’t, as in as much of a communicative relationship. And the women are carrying a load. Right. They’re carrying a lot because, you know, there’s still the traditional male role in terms of time for men, and they get to go have their hobbies and do these things. And the woman’s doing the child rearing dishes, the cooking, and the bread winning on top of it. 

Neela [00:16:30]:

Right, right. 

Mary Beth [00:16:31]:

And so what types of systems of support do you have in place? 

Neela [00:16:36]:

Yeah, I did a speaking event this weekend, and I got asked that question from somebody who was like, when you’re doing it all, how do you even begin to open up these conversations with your spouse? And it’s like, the number one piece is, well, don’t do it when you’re really frustrated or at the end of your rope, which is the default, because you generally just, like, snap. And then that’s when the conversation happens, and we can all imagine how. How well those conversations go. So, like, I think one of the best places to start. And if you can do it, just the two of you, you might need to bring in a third person to make for kind of a safer conversation, to employ some good communication tools, like nonviolent communication, but really setting a time aside where you can focus on the conversation when nobody’s feeling heated about a dishwasher not being unloaded and, like, begin to have those conversations together. 

Mary Beth [00:17:25]:

Yeah. 

Neela [00:17:25]:

Recognizing that everybody’s coming from different places, everybody has fear, everybody has shame. But as a family unit, you want to do things together. So, like, we got to make this work. 

Mary Beth [00:17:35]:

Yeah. I will say the other thing. This might be an unpopular opinion. 

Neela [00:17:40]:

Ooh, do it. 

Mary Beth [00:17:42]:

We give men a lot of leeway. Women give men a lot of leeway. And at some point in time, you also get to put your foot down, because we do. It’s on us to bring the conversation to the table. What we’re saying, we’re telling women, make sure you have this conversation right. At some point in time, men have to see the load that women are carrying in the household, and they have to recognize it, and they need to come to the table, and they can’t be surprised when women lose their minds yeah, that’s just like partnership in general. So we’re saying heterosexual. But again, in partnerships in general, it’s an equal partnership. And so if you for some reason feel like maybe it’s not equal, you can roll your eyes at Neela and I, as we’re telling you, do more work and try and get, you know, your partner to the table. It’s also okay to have boundaries and to be fed up and you have to make decisions for your life depending on how long it’s been going on because sometimes you can talk until you’re blue in the face. And so I do want to recognize that and that society as a whole, one of the things is we give a lot of permission because, you know, women tend to be the ones who do a lot of that self work and reflection and mental health and personal growth. It’s big market, especially for women. And so it might be unpopular to say that, but I do want to put that out there because I know what our listeners relationships look like. And sometimes you just need the permission to call it as well. 

Neela [00:18:51]:

I’m actually really happy you said that because it reminds me of that book Fair Play, which is basically, it’s like the load that women are carrying, all the individual tasks. And, like, every time things get out of whack in my house, which is generally me getting frustrated in being like, something’s gone out of whack and we’re no longer 50 50, and it’s like we’ve crept up to like 60 40, 70 30, where I’m feeling like too much is happening. My husband would be like, well, what are the things that you’re carrying on your mind? And I will start spitting things out. And, like, the number of things that come out of my mouth so quickly is always shocking to him. 

Mary Beth [00:19:30]:

Yes. 

Neela [00:19:30]:

Where I’m like, oh, well, we’ve got Sandy’s birthday party and we also have three dentist appointments that we have to plan and then we also have to make this return happen. And also we’ve got somebody coming to the repair of the door. We got to make sure somebody’s home to do that. And it’s like you start going and then you’re going and going. You’re like, oh, gosh. 

Mary Beth [00:19:48]:

Sometimes it’s like, yeah, you’re like, supposed to be therapeutic, but you’re also like, this is a lot. 

Neela [00:19:52]:

This is a lot. And you’re like, oh, my God, this is all just in my brain. 

Mary Beth [00:19:55]:

Yes. 

Neela [00:19:55]:

I don’t have, like, a master list. And I think it’s often unfair, too, to be like, well, give me the list in your head. 

Mary Beth [00:20:01]:

Give me the list. 

Neela [00:20:03]:

We both need to carry lists. 

Mary Beth [00:20:05]:

Both need to carry lists.

Neela [00:20:06]:

We both do. 

Mary Beth [00:20:06]:

We do. Yes. That is a big one. It’s like, just tell me what you want me to do, and I’ll do it. I’m like, no, no, no. I just want you to do it. Or also, you know, I want you to know the things to do and do them, and then, you know, we have the I’ll do it, and then I can’t close the tab until it’s done because. 

Neela [00:20:20]:

Close the loop.

Mary Beth [00:20:21]:

Somewhere along the way, we know that there are things that have not gotten done when they said they would be done, and so there’s this fear that the thing won’t get done. Yeah. And so for me, I can’t close the tab until it’s done. And so even though it’s like, yeah, I’ll get done 72 hours later, I’m like, that thing done? And it’s like, oh, I’m gonna do that. Haven’t done it yet. I’m like, I can’t close it until it’s done. So there’s still on. Now it’s on both. I haven’t transferred it over, and so I don’t know if that’s just, like, my controlling personality. 

Neela [00:20:47]:

Same. 

Mary Beth [00:20:48]:

But I do know a lot of overachieving, bread winning women who are like this, like us. So, yeah. 

Neela [00:20:53]:

The number one thing that I remember my mom, not number one, but one of the momisms that I took with me growing up is her saying, finish the job. You take out the garbage. You put a new bag in, and you close the garbage. Yes, finish the job. And so, like, I think what we’re saying is delegating and dividing responsibilities is fine, but there needs to be communication about those pieces, whether it comes to your finances or what the household tasks are. Making sure that communication is happening both ways, but that there is an accountability person is really helpful.

Mary Beth [00:21:27]:

Yes. Accountability person, 100%. 

Neela [00:21:30]:

My husband does all appointments. 

Mary Beth [00:21:31]:

Yeah, so does mine. 

Neela [00:21:33]:

Yeah, I’m like, you’re in charge of dentists, you’re in charge of doctors, you’re in charge of all of those things. 

Mary Beth [00:21:38]:

Yeah. I was actually thinking today, don’t judge me. I haven’t been to any of my kids dentist appointments in their life. 

Neela [00:21:42]:

Yeah. 

Mary Beth [00:21:43]:

In their lives. 

Neela [00:21:43]:

I get that. I’ve been to very few. 

Mary Beth [00:21:45]:

Yeah. Again, thank you, Brian. 

Neela [00:21:47]:

Yes, thank you, Tom. I haven’t been to the pediatrician in a couple of years.

Mary Beth [00:21:50]:

Yeah. I don’t have to worry about it, you know, but I carry emotional health and a variety of other things that get carried around in terms of. Ellie wants to wear lipstick at eight years old. So I have everything on my plate. 

Neela [00:22:01]:

You’re like, can I have dentist back? 

Mary Beth [00:22:03]:

Yeah, I’ll take dentist. I was like, you’re too young for me to be sharing my makeup and my clothes with you. She stole, like, a sweatshirt over the weekend. I’m like, this is just because I’m short. I am very short in real life. She’s started co opting my clothes. Not ready. Okay. What else do we got here? 

Neela [00:22:20]:

I think we hit most of them. The only other one that I would hit is women are bad at math. That’s just not true. We’re not bad at math. 

Mary Beth [00:22:28]:

We’re not bad at math. And the self deprecation around money and math, investing, like, all of it.

Neela [00:22:35]:

Yeah. 

Mary Beth [00:22:36]:

We have to stop. We have to catch ourselves in it, because I catch highly educated, highly powerful women. 

Neela [00:22:42]:

Yes. 

Mary Beth [00:22:43]:

In this self deprecation of… 

Neela [00:22:45]:

I’m not good at this. 

Mary Beth [00:22:46]:

Not good at this. Yeah. And it is absolutely not true, which we feed into those stereotypes. We’re doing that we’re adding on to it and being able to switch that mindset and terminology that we use. 

Neela [00:22:57]:

Yeah. I love that. I learned something from my daughter’s school where it’s not, I’m bad at this. It’s I’m still working on that. Yeah, I’m still learning. 

Mary Beth [00:23:05]:

Yes! I’m still learning.

Neela [00:23:06]:

Yeah. 

Mary Beth [00:23:06]:

Still learning.

Neela [00:23:07]:

So it’s a good reframe. 

Mary Beth [00:23:08]:

I love that. All right. That was our soapbox moment for stereotypes. We hope it was helpful to you. I think it was message sent. 

Neela [00:23:20]:

A couple of good nuggets. Couple of good takeaways. Get on the same page as your spouse with whatever you’re talking about and recalibrate good relationships. It’s all recalibration. You’re never done having these conversations. 

Mary Beth [00:23:31]:

You’re not. This is a journey.

Neela [00:23:20]:

That’s it. 

Mary Beth [00:23:20]:

Thanks, y’all. 

Neela [00:23:20]:

Thank you.

Mary Beth [00:23:20]:

Financial knowledge is for everyone. If you enjoyed today’s episode of If Money Were Easy and you’re looking for more tools and resources to expand what’s possible with your money, head to www.learnwithabacus.com. Abacus Wealth Partners elearning platform offering a variety of courses to empower you in your financial life.

Mary Beth [00:24:19]:

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